When VSTOL is a real advantage!

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Ricky
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When VSTOL is a real advantage!

Postby Ricky » Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:27 am

"Study the past, if you would divine the future"
-Confucius

"I am pedantic, I'm just being overshadowed by Ricky so it isn't as noticable as it would else have been"
-Skua

dutchman
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Re: When VSTOL is a real advantage!

Postby dutchman » Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:06 pm

As far as speed and climb and what not the "jump jets" as a rule will be a little behind a standard fighter. So you need to keep them where they are better then no jet at all. If we here in the United States wanted to get serious about stopping the flow of drugs through the Gulf of Mexico for example. Grabbing 6-8 out of service oil drilling platforms and fitting them out as home to a couple of these jets and a couple of helos and instant storm proof outpost. Or in a jungle or mountain terrain where an airstrip isn't possible. They have their uses, you can convert a small ship to handle a couple, so you have produced a minimum amount of air support. But if the other guy doesn't have jets, you can dominate the skies!
Truly an interesting tactical weapon, a great little add to any air force. But it was never ment to replace regular fighters in service.

Oli
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Re: When VSTOL is a real advantage!

Postby Oli » Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:31 pm

dutchman wrote:As far as speed and climb and what not the "jump jets" as a rule will be a little behind a standard fighter.

Maxima will be lower on a "jump jet", but initial acceleration and climb will be higher.
By necessity Harriers have a minimum thrust: weight ratio somewhere around 1.2:1 at VTO weights - a figure not normally matched until you get to the very modern "super fighters" at combat weight (approx 50% fuel and air-air load out only).
There's an old tale about a USN F-4 Phantom pilot offering to "race" a USMC Harrier (early model if memory serves). When the Harrier pilot accepted the Phantom hit his afterburners and then looked in his rear-view mirror.
Unable to see the Harrier he thought he'd massively and conclusively won, until he looked forward and up: the Harrier was way out in front and climbing.

dutchman
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Re: When VSTOL is a real advantage!

Postby dutchman » Sun Jul 13, 2014 11:22 am

I always loved the old F-4 Phantom, it proved with enough power even a brick could fly! As for being out run by a Harrier the secret is keep it a short race. The Harrier tops out at about 700 MPH so in any distance a plane that breaks mach 1 will beat it. Back when I was a young man and still fit in track and field I won a bet with a local show off. While I was doing my laps on the track he was in the parking lot with his 1000cc motorcycle raising hell. When I got done and was going to my car I spoke wiith him a bit and turned the topic to how fast the bike was. He bragged a while, then I told him I could out run his bike on foot from a standing start. So we set up a race It was a only 20 yards, I beat him by about 3 feet. If it had of been 22 yards he would have buried me. If the race is set up right quick will beat fast in the short haul. But in the slightly longer distance fast will catch up and pass you like you were tied. I think in any race between an F-4 and a Harrier, the distance of the race determines the winner. ;)

Hoosier
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Re: When VSTOL is a real advantage!

Postby Hoosier » Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:34 pm

Try this landing with a conventional aircraft and no operable nose gear!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIhefke0Q9Y
http://theaviationist.com/2014/06/26/no ... nding-av8/
--Tim


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